Do you experience cycling knee pain? Do the images above look familiar? Are your knees going outward when you pedal? If not, you’ve likely noticed this when riding with others. The origins lie in an under-discussed topic in cycling: stance width.
Stance width
Here’s a fun exercise to find out what we mean by “stance width.”
- Stand up.
- Take a few steps.
- Stop and stand in a comfortable position with your legs side-by-side.
Look at your feet. This is your natural stance width that your body selects when you are not clipped into the pedals. Now, for fun, clip into your pedals on the bike and observe how your normal stance on your feet and your bike setup may be different.
We are not suggesting that you mimic the exact comfortable standing stance to your bike setup, but it does give you an idea of why many people experience discomfort on the bike. When you performed the exercise above, you may have noticed that your feet are wider apart than on your bike or that your feet “toe out” to the side.
Clipping into a pedal may limit your natural position, but we promise you don’t have to quit cycling and sell your bike.
The knee followeth the foot
Going back to our illustrations above, when you clip into the pedal, the foot does not have a choice to move. Consequently, the knee kicks out at the top of the pedal stroke (going where it wants to) and then, because it is attached to the foot, follows it inward at the bottom of the stroke. After thousands of revolutions (a 2-hour ride could have 10,000 depending on how fast you pedal), you may develop some significant knee pain.
Solution #1 – Cleat in = foot out
In the earlier days of cycling, the default was to tell the rider to bring their knees in to meet their feet. Sadly, this may cause even more knee pain. The best solution is to move your cleat in, which in turn, will move your foot out to meet your knee. This simple change will help with your knee alignment and potentially alleviate cycling knee discomfort.
Solution #2 – Pedal Washers or Pedal Spacers
If you’ve already moved your cleats in completely but your knee continues to push outward, try adding 1.5mm washer (only use one) to the pedal spindle where it attaches to the crank arm.
If you have a wider stance width (many riders do), you may require more lateral (foot out) adjustment. 20mm Pedal Spacers provide the extra length. 20mm spacers require a 15mm pedal wrench but we also provide Hex+ 20mm Pedal Spacers for pedals that install using a 5mm or 6mm hex key wrench.
Results
Now that you’ve moved the foot outward, you likely increased your comfort, alleviated knee pain, and aligned your feet to your knees. Your pedal stroke should look more like the image below:
Eurika! You’ve maximized your ability to apply power to the pedals and now can ride off into the sunset (without having to ice your knees or visit an orthopedist when you arrive home). Remember that bikes are symmetrical and people are not. Take this into account and assure that you and your normal, asymmetrical human parts are customized to fit your bicycle.
So if I try pedal spacers, and only one knee is bugging me, should I only put the one spacer on?
Yes! The body is asymmetrical so it’s possible each leg will require it’s own specific stance width.
Hi – interesting article – however is there a way to do the opposite? Being smaller and female my natural stance is narrower than on the bike. When I used flat pedals I was ok, but have recently moved to cleats and now get medial knee pain. I think having my feet fixed in a wider position js causing me the troubles. I have moved my cleats out (so foot is in) but this doesn’t seem to give much of a difference. Thanks
Hi Natasha–This is a great point and I’m glad you mentioned this. Yes, the problem is the stance width generalized for the “average” vs. the indivdiual. You made the correct move in moving the cleats out to bring the feet in. If this is not enough, I would suggest getting a professional fit and discussing the stance width issue. There are some pedals that provide a shorter spindle which may be beneficial.
This is very interesting. I suffer from pain in my right knee during long steep climbs, maybe increasing the stance can help. Do you have spacers/extenders shorter than 20mm? It seems a bit too much’ I would start with 10 or even 5mm.
Unfortunately, we don’t. As you can imagine, in order to create an extender, it needs to have enough space to allow a pedal to thread into it entirely. Consequently, it must be a longer length to accommodate and have some extra for different length threads. You could start by moving your cleat inward (toward the crank) which would push your foot out.
Wish I knew before… I’m suffering from tear medial meniscus posterior horn 😞
HI!
What if you get knee pain extending AROUND the front of the knee below the patella? It feels like a band from the lateral collateral ligament insertion on the fibula to the medial collateral ligament insertion on the tibia. I feel like that area below the knee is twisting separately from the area above the knee. I guess the thigh wants to go one way and the lower leg has to twist in order for the foot to meet the pedal?
Thank you for you response
Lisa–thank you for your message. While the article suggests some ideas and solutions to a problem, each person is different. It’s difficult to assess an individual problem without doing a full assessment of you on the bike. I strongly recommend seeing a professional fitter who can help you solve your pain issues.
This is really interesting, I ride with half clips, and have been getting horrible pain in my right knee and lower quad. I was tempted to get a bike fit, but think this is quite pointless without cleats?
Hi John–Absolutely not. Bike fitting is for everyone and any qualified professional would be happy to help solve this issue for you. Whether you have cleats or flat pedals, bike fitting can benefit anyone. See our BikeFit locator to find someone near you!
this could be a silly question but is each leg different? My left leg tracks fine with the cleat centered but my right knee tracks outward and has the cleat as far inward as possible. Should I be extending one pedal or start by moving the left cleat inward?
Peter,
This is not a silly question–it’s a great one! The human body is asymmetrical while the bike is symmetrical. As a result, your setup from cleat to cleat can be quite different. In a more recent article, we published a section on “single-leg stance width.” https://blog.bikefit.com/bicycle-stance-width/ To specifically answer your question, it’s hard to tell you exactly what to do without an examination but you are on the right track. It sounds like you’ve adjusted the cleat as far inward for the right foot as possible. Therefore, if you’re trying to move the foot further, you’ll need a 1.5mm spacer or a 20mm extender. If you go with the 20mm, you’ll need to adjust the cleat position relative to the amount of width you individually require.
Is this stance width a problem only if you clip in when you ride?
Hi Sheila,
No, it is a problem for riders who use flat pedals as well. Although you can place your foot in the position you want, we do have many flat-pedal riders who do not clip-in that require 20mm pedal extenders.
What would cause the inner thigh muscles to engage while riding? My inner thigh muscles are very evidently growing since biking. FYI, I walk with my toes turned out.
I get pain in the front of my knee when I ride on a Peleton or similar indoor bike that has a wider q-factor than my road bike. I have relatively narrow hips.
Hi Dwight–Although we look at wider trends in this article, you are correct that some people would benefit from a narrow stance width. Although, pain in the front of your knee could also be coming from other sources (saddle position, height, cleat placement…etc). The hip width you mentioned, is a concept we should explore. Thanks for the comment!
Thanks for the info.
I’m frustrated by lateral knee pain. I’ll have a look at my set up and get back to you.
It’s pretty common. Let us know!